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Differentiate drivers

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Zak Brown
2 years 166 days ago

After reading the blog I'm aware that more levels are going to be introduced so I assume drivers attribute cap will also increase. Therefore I believe this is a perfect opportunity to make drivers attributes more interesting. In end game most drivers have all 20 stats, there is very little things differentiate them, so for drivers beyond 20 it would be good to make gaining attributes cost significantly more exp so that it is almost impossible to max out every stats before the driver retires. This way we will have one driver good at fast corner and another one good at slower corner instead of 20 everything.

Jackson Kincaid
2 years 166 days ago

I think this is a pretty great idea.

Minh Hiếu Lê
2 years 166 days ago

Jackson

I think this is a pretty great idea.

Nice one!

Alex Valley
2 years 165 days ago

I wish more unchangeable driver attributes will be implemented, so that driver performance will vary depending on fuel/tyres/(not) fave racetrack even if stats we have at the moment are identical.

Kevin Bissell Super Mod
2 years 164 days ago

Personally I would welcome the devs re-introducing "driver atrophy" which is something that used to be in the game until the new version was launched in August 2016.

How this worked is the driver would slowly deteriorate. Some of the attributes would drop in value every race which meant you had to keep training them to recover the lost skills. When the driver was young the loss was very small and it was no problem to keep up with the deterioration by training after every race.

As they got older the losses increased until it got to a point where they would deteriorate faster than you could re-train them. So drivers didn't usually retire, Managers had to renew them because they either became uncompetitive or cost too many tokens to keep them fully trained.

Gert Rose Super Mod
2 years 164 days ago

Kevin

As they got older the losses increased until it got to a point where they would deteriorate faster than you could re-train them. So drivers didn't usually retire, Managers had to renew them because they either became uncompetitive or cost too many tokens to keep them fully trained.

I wonder if there is still part of that somewhere in a forgotten piece of code... my drivers used to set the exact same qualifying times. Since one of them turned 40, he's about 0.05-0.1s slower than the other one.

Community Manager
2 years 164 days ago

Very interesting discussion in this topic with good ideas.

Minh Hiếu Lê
2 years 164 days ago

Kevin

Personally I would welcome the devs re-introducing "driver atrophy" which is something that used to be in the game until the new version was launched in August 2016.

How this worked is the driver would slowly deteriorate. Some of the attributes would drop in value every race which meant you had to keep training them to recover the lost skills. When the driver was young the loss was very small and it was no problem to keep up with the deterioration by training after every race.

As they got older the losses increased until it got to a point where they would deteriorate faster than you could re-train them. So drivers didn't usually retire, Managers had to renew them because they either became uncompetitive or cost too many tokens to keep them fully trained.

Totally agree with that mate!

Wholly Crap
2 years 164 days ago (Last edited by Wholly Crap 2 years 164 days ago)

Kevin

As they got older the losses increased until it got to a point where they would deteriorate faster than you could re-train them. So drivers didn't usually retire, Managers had to renew them because they either became uncompetitive or cost too many tokens to keep them fully trained.

So bringing that back will just cause it to be pay to win, you have to pay to train or you have to pay for new drivers, the current token cost of new drivers is ridiculous, that's even if you can find a decent one in the academy to start with, I've heard of people wasting many 100s of tokens trying to find a decent one without success. It currently takes many seasons just to get the driver exp to level 20 at which time they are getting older every season, with your idea they will then need constant training at token costs or replacing due to being too old. The current system works as in real life, a driver races until exp reaches 20 then can stay there for approx 10-12 seasons before retiring

Minh Hiếu Lê
2 years 163 days ago

Wholly

Kevin

As they got older the losses increased until it got to a point where they would deteriorate faster than you could re-train them. So drivers didn't usually retire, Managers had to renew them because they either became uncompetitive or cost too many tokens to keep them fully trained.

So bringing that back will just cause it to be pay to win, you have to pay to train or you have to pay for new drivers, the current token cost of new drivers is ridiculous, that's even if you can find a decent one in the academy to start with, I've heard of people wasting many 100s of tokens trying to find a decent one without success. It currently takes many seasons just to get the driver exp to level 20 at which time they are getting older every season, with your idea they will then need constant training at token costs or replacing due to being too old. The current system works as in real life, a driver races until exp reaches 20 then can stay there for approx 10-12 seasons before retiring

Personally, I think that the current experience system (10 races = 1 level of experience) doesn't work well with <5 experience drivers (especialy in the academy). It means that they have to be driving for somewhat 10 seasons to get to level 20. At that time, they will already be >25, so the fact that they can stay there for 10-12 seasons is OK (like F.Alonso in F1), but after all, academy drivers are very expensive. Imagine that you get only maximunly 3 tokens for evert race, while a talent 1 driver already costs you 15 tokens. If they don't pay, how long will they have to wait to earn a good driver? This is still not the end actually; for high lvl managers, they will use the driver with higher experience to race and earn championships, so how can these "new" drivers develop? Or if they take the risk and let these academy drivers race, it will be very hard for them to win the championship because of their lack of experience.

And, as the academy is developed the latest in terms of HQ upgrades, it may be not worth pouring millions to upgrade the academy and wait for days, or even months to get new drivers while you can go to the market and get good drivers anyway (they can be not that old, as drivers only ages when they race)

Wholly Crap
2 years 163 days ago (Last edited by Wholly Crap 2 years 163 days ago)

Minh

Personally, I think that the current experience system (10 races = 1 level of experience) doesn't work well with <5 experience drivers (especialy in the academy). It means that they have to be driving for somewhat 10 seasons to get to level 20. At that time, they will already be >25, so the fact that they can stay there for 10-12 seasons is OK (like F.Alonso in F1), but after all, academy drivers are very expensive. Imagine that you get only maximunly 3 tokens for evert race, while a talent 1 driver already costs you 15 tokens. If they don't pay, how long will they have to wait to earn a good driver? This is still not the end actually; for high lvl managers, they will use the driver with higher experience to race and earn championships, so how can these "new" drivers develop? Or if they take the risk and let these academy drivers race, it will be very hard for them to win the championship because of their lack of experience.

I'm all for keeping drivers for as long as possible, I don't want to be changing them every few seasons, or wasting money keeping them competitive like the old system, as drivers get closer to retirement it's time to start preparing the next one's to replace them.
To develop drivers you set up a second team, get drivers from you elite academy, sell them to your new second team and enter them into races, that way you can train and develop exp at the same time. Once the experience level is approx 12-14 you then sell them back into your main team and wait until the whole process starts again. The salary will be higher as they left and returned but it's the way to keep your main team competitive all the time.
Once an academy is above level 14 talent 20 drivers appear more readily and once at academy level 20 they are are very frequent, a talent 20 driver is 50 tokens, if you think you can keep them for 15 seasons at 20 races you will get way more tokens back during that time than what you spent.

Kevin Bissell Super Mod
2 years 163 days ago

Wholly

Kevin

As they got older the losses increased until it got to a point where they would deteriorate faster than you could re-train them. So drivers didn't usually retire, Managers had to renew them because they either became uncompetitive or cost too many tokens to keep them fully trained.

So bringing that back will just cause it to be pay to win, you have to pay to train or you have to pay for new drivers, the current token cost of new drivers is ridiculous, that's even if you can find a decent one in the academy to start with, I've heard of people wasting many 100s of tokens trying to find a decent one without success. It currently takes many seasons just to get the driver exp to level 20 at which time they are getting older every season, with your idea they will then need constant training at token costs or replacing due to being too old. The current system works as in real life, a driver races until exp reaches 20 then can stay there for approx 10-12 seasons before retiring

At the risk of straying off topic, I don't think this does cause the game to be Pay to Win.

IMHO pay to win games are structured in such a way as the more money you invest in the game the more successful you will be. iGP isn't like this, you can already accelerate HQ development, driver and staff scouting and driver training by throwing real money at it but you are ultimately limited by the level of your team and your ability to play the game. So someone who is prepared to spend real money will get there more quickly but still won't be able to beat a top manager who spends nothing.

Although it's a difficult balance for the iGP owners, personally I see no reason why they shouldn't structure the game in such a way that a small real money investment is required to remain competitive. At the end of the day they have developers wages to pay, an IT infrastructure to fund and there needs to be a profit in it because, like everyone else, they too have families to feed and bills to pay.

People who play this game are no doubt comfortable paying for other forms of entertainment such as Video and Audio streaming services, mobile phones, console games, cinema tickets etc. Is it wrong that they should also be expected to pay a proportionate amount for the entertainment that iGP provides? I don't understand how the current model allows the game to survive, let alone the huge steps forward that we've seen in the last 12 months.

This is my personal opinion which is why I don't post with my Mod account.

David Lyons
2 years 158 days ago

Hi everyone

Best way for Attributes to work is the 20 should be the standard for all drivers at the top tier. But after this you have hidden attributes for each one.

Lets say for every Attribute, you add varying attribute rolls to each attribute

For Fast Corners, Slow Corners, Defending and Attacking. Randomly D4, D6, D8 and D10 are assigned to each one and rolled.
For Composure, Focus, Knowledge, and Stamina. Randomly D4, D6, D8 and D10 are assign to each one and rolls.

The results of this random bonus is secret per driver. But What we can see is an expectation in where some drivers excel and would be presented like this to us of a fully trained driver and their true Attributes (which we don't see is represented in brackets)

Fast Corners 20-26 (24)
Slow Corners 20-28 (20)
Defending 20-30 (25)
Attacking 20-24 (24)

Composure 20-30 (28)
Focus 20-24 (22)
Knowledge 20-26 (21)
Stamina 20-28 (27)

Each season, the driver's stats are rerolled using the existing assigned Dice for their stat so it may change to like

Fast Corners 20-26 (26)
Slow Corners 20-28 (22)
Defending 20-30 (24)
Attacking 20-24 (22)

Composure 20-30 (30)
Focus 20-24 (24)
Knowledge 20-26 (22)
Stamina 20-28 (21)

What this system allows is:

The Driver has a variance to other Drivers, two drivers with same Attribute distribution will be rare.
The Driver has the ability to change their driving style in a limited way, keeping true to their true strengths and weaknesses.
The Driver can't be read like a manual, or on box instructions of exact stats available to them, but an estimate which can vary.
The manager cannot plan to have a perfect driver, only have a driver who works well who can be in good form, or bad form.

Zak Brown
2 years 158 days ago

I agree with this one, this is the best way to differentiate driver in my opinion I hope the developer could consider it!

Dino Kea
2 years 157 days ago

David

Hi everyone

Best way for Attributes to work is the 20 should be the standard for all drivers at the top tier. But after this you have hidden attributes for each one.

Lets say for every Attribute, you add varying attribute rolls to each attribute

For Fast Corners, Slow Corners, Defending and Attacking. Randomly D4, D6, D8 and D10 are assigned to each one and rolled.
For Composure, Focus, Knowledge, and Stamina. Randomly D4, D6, D8 and D10 are assign to each one and rolls.

The results of this random bonus is secret per driver. But What we can see is an expectation in where some drivers excel and would be presented like this to us of a fully trained driver and their true Attributes (which we don't see is represented in brackets)

Fast Corners 20-26 (24)
Slow Corners 20-28 (20)
Defending 20-30 (25)
Attacking 20-24 (24)

Composure 20-30 (28)
Focus 20-24 (22)
Knowledge 20-26 (21)
Stamina 20-28 (27)

Each season, the driver's stats are rerolled using the existing assigned Dice for their stat so it may change to like

Fast Corners 20-26 (26)
Slow Corners 20-28 (22)
Defending 20-30 (24)
Attacking 20-24 (22)

Composure 20-30 (30)
Focus 20-24 (24)
Knowledge 20-26 (22)
Stamina 20-28 (21)

What this system allows is:

The Driver has a variance to other Drivers, two drivers with same Attribute distribution will be rare.
The Driver has the ability to change their driving style in a limited way, keeping true to their true strengths and weaknesses.
The Driver can't be read like a manual, or on box instructions of exact stats available to them, but an estimate which can vary.
The manager cannot plan to have a perfect driver, only have a driver who works well who can be in good form, or bad form.

This one I'm definitely down for. As an alternative, you could make it a modifier than changes seasonally, allowing for differences at the lower levels too, although this could potentially make things more confusing at lower levels

As an aside that doesn't need to be considered, you probably also use this to add the aging system someone mentioned earlier where drivers could at a certain age gain a chance of a decreased dice max coming, although depending on the partner system, this could lead to decreased loyalty to drivers between seasons.

My alternate idea could be driver personalities, even if it's just 2 traits, a positive one and a negative one. It could make great drivers rarer (particularly if different traits have rarities) although I'm not sure how complexities of it might work.

Minh Hiếu Lê
2 years 156 days ago

Dino

David

Hi everyone

Best way for Attributes to work is the 20 should be the standard for all drivers at the top tier. But after this you have hidden attributes for each one.

Lets say for every Attribute, you add varying attribute rolls to each attribute

For Fast Corners, Slow Corners, Defending and Attacking. Randomly D4, D6, D8 and D10 are assigned to each one and rolled.
For Composure, Focus, Knowledge, and Stamina. Randomly D4, D6, D8 and D10 are assign to each one and rolls.

The results of this random bonus is secret per driver. But What we can see is an expectation in where some drivers excel and would be presented like this to us of a fully trained driver and their true Attributes (which we don't see is represented in brackets)

Fast Corners 20-26 (24)
Slow Corners 20-28 (20)
Defending 20-30 (25)
Attacking 20-24 (24)

Composure 20-30 (28)
Focus 20-24 (22)
Knowledge 20-26 (21)
Stamina 20-28 (27)

Each season, the driver's stats are rerolled using the existing assigned Dice for their stat so it may change to like

Fast Corners 20-26 (26)
Slow Corners 20-28 (22)
Defending 20-30 (24)
Attacking 20-24 (22)

Composure 20-30 (30)
Focus 20-24 (24)
Knowledge 20-26 (22)
Stamina 20-28 (21)

What this system allows is:

The Driver has a variance to other Drivers, two drivers with same Attribute distribution will be rare.
The Driver has the ability to change their driving style in a limited way, keeping true to their true strengths and weaknesses.
The Driver can't be read like a manual, or on box instructions of exact stats available to them, but an estimate which can vary.
The manager cannot plan to have a perfect driver, only have a driver who works well who can be in good form, or bad form.

This one I'm definitely down for. As an alternative, you could make it a modifier than changes seasonally, allowing for differences at the lower levels too, although this could potentially make things more confusing at lower levels

As an aside that doesn't need to be considered, you probably also use this to add the aging system someone mentioned earlier where drivers could at a certain age gain a chance of a decreased dice max coming, although depending on the partner system, this could lead to decreased loyalty to drivers between seasons.

My alternate idea could be driver personalities, even if it's just 2 traits, a positive one and a negative one. It could make great drivers rarer (particularly if different traits have rarities) although I'm not sure how complexities of it might work.

Yeah, traits can also be a great addition to players, just like in MMR

Dortmund Simp
2 years 155 days ago

Adding new attributes could be helpful to differentiate driver. For example, starts, awareness, and individual perks and disadvantages like for chief designers, such as one lap legend and tyre saver, but also tyre eater and poor defender could be used.

For more example see https://igpmanager.com/forum-thread/44331

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