ios-personmd-notifications md-help-circle

Profile

  • Guest
    medal 0
  • Posts: 21
  • Post Likes: 3765

Notifications

  • No Unread Notifications

Suggested
Auto-DNF no setup cars

warning
This thread is closed. Threads older than 6 weeks are closed automatically. To continue this discussion, create a new thread.
angle-double-left ios-arrow-back 1 ios-arrow-forward angle-double-right
medal 5260
1 year 23 days ago
Is it possible to auto-DNF cars that don't setup. It's really annoying dealing with backmarkers in leagues where you have a good amount of live racers but a handful of cars that don't setup. Even in private/competitive leagues, if someone tries to setup in such a way to DNF their car by running out of fuel...it can sometimes wreak havok. Basically if a car doesn't do a practice lap, can they be made to auto-DNF from the start? Might reduce load on servers too...I don't know.
md-quotelink
medal 5000
1 year 23 days ago
Good suggestion, bump^
md-quotelink
medal 5000
1 year 23 days ago
I love it . Everyone knows how big pain in the a... the backmarkers are
md-quotelink
medal 4781
1 year 23 days ago
OMG Yes please!!! 
md-quotelink
medal 4962
1 year 22 days ago
This game is over 10 years old, it should be a priority issue. There is no car set up for the race, so it shouldn't be on the grid. Should be easy for developers to do, right??
md-quotelink
medal 5543
1 year 22 days ago
Agree with this, but how exactly would you classify a car as without setup? Practice laps shouldn’t be a criteria in my opinion since its totally possible to setup the car without any practice laps (based off previous data, especially if someone is running short on time). The only possibility I see if the game takes into account the amount of fuel, but it should be made sure that stock fuel level significantly higher than normal usage (Maybe set to the maximum value).
md-quotelink
medal 5000 Super Mod
1 year 22 days ago
Apply the 107% rule. If you fail to qualify within 107% of pole you are not permitted to race.
md-quotelink
medal 6216
1 year 21 days ago
Kevin
Apply the 107% rule. If you fail to qualify within 107% of pole you are not permitted to race.



I like that idea lol, it means no sponsor income and no sponsor tokens.
md-quotelink
medal 5260
1 year 21 days ago (Last edited by Yousuf Azadzoi 1 year 21 days ago)
Kevin
Apply the 107% rule. If you fail to qualify within 107% of pole you are not permitted to race.



I'd be ok with that too. It could get a little screwy if it's a wet race and someone messed up advanced strategy. I just think it's pretty clear cut that if a car doesn't setup and do a practice lap; that they should be eliminated from the race. 


I'm in a few fun leagues. But when 20 cars are active and setup, and the other 10 are just over-fueled backmarkers on mediums... It ruins what could otherwise be good races when those cars start interfering in drs zones or even cause you to slow down from dirty air. 

I also imagine that eliminating those cars from the computing would ease some stress on the servers and bandwidth. 

@Fried Rice

I understand what you mean. And I've done setups without any practice laps... But very rarely. I was just trying to think of a way to simplify it and not over-complicate it. I think in 99.9% of situations, a car with no practice laps has no setup and the manager doesn't intend to race.
md-quotelink
medal 5000
1 year 21 days ago
Yousuf
Kevin
Apply the 107% rule. If you fail to qualify within 107% of pole you are not permitted to race.



I'd be ok with that too. It could get a little screwy if it's a wet race and someone messed up advanced strategy. I just think it's pretty clear cut that if a car doesn't setup and do a practice lap; that they should be eliminated from the race. 


I'm in a few fun leagues. But when 20 cars are active and setup, and the other 10 are just over-fueled backmarkers on mediums... It ruins what could otherwise be good races when those cars start interfering in drs zones or even cause you to slow down from dirty air. 

I also imagine that eliminating those cars from the computing would ease some stress on the servers and bandwidth. 

@Fried Rice

I understand what you mean. And I've done setups without any practice laps... But very rarely. I was just trying to think of a way to simplify it and not over-complicate it. I think in 99.9% of situations, a car with no practice laps has no setup and the manager doesn't intend to race.



I don’t agree that 99.9% of cars with no practice laps mean no set up. Practice laps are almost an irrelevance once you have sufficient data so for me using this criteria is a non starter.  Kevin’s idea might work, but could also preclude beginners who have yet to understand the basic mechanics (exclusion would just be another reason for them to quit after a few non races) and sometimes you want to hide your pace from competitors by running a single practice with either no set up or perhaps just with wets or no practice laps if you have to data for set up, fuel loads, tyre wear etc.


I’m not against the principle and whether the Devs would be prepared to implement it is another matter.  Either way it would be nice to see them state an opinion rather than just reject it 
md-quotelink
medal 6216
1 year 21 days ago

Skid
Yousuf
Kevin
Apply the 107% rule. If you fail to qualify within 107% of pole you are not permitted to race.



I'd be ok with that too. It could get a little screwy if it's a wet race and someone messed up advanced strategy. I just think it's pretty clear cut that if a car doesn't setup and do a practice lap; that they should be eliminated from the race. 


I'm in a few fun leagues. But when 20 cars are active and setup, and the other 10 are just over-fueled backmarkers on mediums... It ruins what could otherwise be good races when those cars start interfering in drs zones or even cause you to slow down from dirty air. 

I also imagine that eliminating those cars from the computing would ease some stress on the servers and bandwidth. 

@Fried Rice

I understand what you mean. And I've done setups without any practice laps... But very rarely. I was just trying to think of a way to simplify it and not over-complicate it. I think in 99.9% of situations, a car with no practice laps has no setup and the manager doesn't intend to race.



I don’t agree that 99.9% of cars with no practice laps mean no set up. Practice laps are almost an irrelevance once you have sufficient data so for me using this criteria is a non starter.  Kevin’s idea might work, but could also preclude beginners who have yet to understand the basic mechanics (exclusion would just be another reason for them to quit after a few non races) and sometimes you want to hide your pace from competitors by running a single practice with either no set up or perhaps just with wets or no practice laps if you have to data for set up, fuel loads, tyre wear etc.


I’m not against the principle and whether the Devs would be prepared to implement it is another matter.  Either way it would be nice to see them state an opinion rather than just reject it 


Doesn't have to be 107% for each tier, maybe be looser for Pro and Rookie. Could also allow it to be possible in just Elite only.

md-quotelink
medal 5000 Super Mod
1 year 21 days ago
My 107% qualifying rule suggestion would only be for the Elite tier. For as long as we have to endure the current tier system we can't exclude non set up teams in the lower two tiers, if we did, in many cases there would be no race. But replacing the tier system with something more appropriate for the game as it is today is off-topic and should be the subject of a separate thread.

To overcome the Advanced Strategy problems, the 107% rule could be ignored if the track is wet at race start or during qualifying. However, seeing as the wet/dry race logic for tyre rules has proved to be so problematic it's just another opportunity for something to break the system.

So given the complexity of introducing something to exclude slow cars in only one tier and only when it's a dry race I guess we'll have to live with what we've got for the time being.
md-quotelink
medal 5286
1 year 21 days ago

Kevin
My 107% qualifying rule suggestion would only be for the Elite tier. For as long as we have to endure the current tier system we can't exclude non set up teams in the lower two tiers, if we did, in many cases there would be no race. But replacing the tier system with something more appropriate for the game as it is today is off-topic and should be the subject of a separate thread.

To overcome the Advanced Strategy problems, the 107% rule could be ignored if the track is wet at race start or during qualifying. However, seeing as the wet/dry race logic for tyre rules has proved to be so problematic it's just another opportunity for something to break the system.

So given the complexity of introducing something to exclude slow cars in only one tier and only when it's a dry race I guess we'll have to live with what we've got for the time being.



Ya I think my idea was to just simplify the system. Make it very cut and dry. So if you intend to race. Throw in a practice lap. It literally takes a few seconds. I was trying to avoid variables such as lap times, fuel loads, ride height adjustments etc... It just gives the system more areas to break or have bugs. 


But I've been in too many leagues now with dead car backmarkers. And it just sucks some of the fun out of the race. 
md-quotelink
medal 5000
1 year 21 days ago
Surely just amend the rules to make sure that teams have to do a practice lap - I appreciate some teams don’t currently because they have so much data they don’t need that extra practice lap to decide strategy - but surely whilst they are reviewing their spreadsheet and polishing their calculators they could click the button execute a practice lap. If you don’t you DNF….. simples. 

I mean red bull don’t just rock up at Monaco and go “yeah don’t worry about practice laps max, we got all the data needed last year”.

And before people start, I get it’s not an F1 simulation but that doesn’t mean it can’t incorporate something done in ‘all’ motorsport
md-quotelink
medal 5000 Super Mod
1 year 21 days ago
I agree non setup cars are an issue, but many leagues have rules around this, inactive accounts in the Elite tier are removed if they fail to set up for "X" races in a season or "Y" consecutive races..

Although the concept of excluding cars that haven't set a practice lap does indeed appear to be a simple solution, as with many suggestions on this forum, the devil is in the detail and what at first appears simple is anything but. Also some of these ideas, when implemented are often undermined by a tiny minority who take delight in proving they can beat the system and overcome any controls that are put in place to benefit the majority.

What do you do about the managers who want their cars to race to harvest sponsor rewards and Manager XP, so log on, click on practice lap, then immediately log off without setting up the cars or setting a decent strategy/push level for AI to work with? They will continue to be a menace to those that have set up.

Late in the season, when the championship has already been decided, in many leagues a higher proportion of lower placed teams will save engines. Even if they do a practice lap and set up they'll still be very slow.

What about two car leagues? Is the logic going to check practice laps for both cars in a team and if necessary only exclude one of the two cars? I don't imagine this would be as simple as excluding a team of one.

How about manager rep? Is this calculation going to be based on the number of cars in the league/tier or the number of cars that actually race on any given day?

What do we do with bot accounts that some leagues place in the lower two tiers to trigger promotion/relegation. Some leagues the lower tiers only have one or two active managers. Would the race still run if only one car sets a practice lap?

We've already seen QRs ruined by people who exploit them to gain driver XP. I fear there will be exploits we haven't even considered that would undermine an apparently simple solution.

I don't disagree with the concept, I too dislike cars that are not set up and encourage managers in the league I host to at least do this. I am just playing devil's advocate and suggesting that what at first appears to be a "simple solution" is often anything but.

md-quotelink
medal 5260
1 year 20 days ago

Kevin
I agree non setup cars are an issue, but many leagues have rules around this, inactive accounts in the Elite tier are removed if they fail to set up for "X" races in a season or "Y" consecutive races..

Although the concept of excluding cars that haven't set a practice lap does indeed appear to be a simple solution, as with many suggestions on this forum, the devil is in the detail and what at first appears simple is anything but. Also some of these ideas, when implemented are often undermined by a tiny minority who take delight in proving they can beat the system and overcome any controls that are put in place to benefit the majority.

What do you do about the managers who want their cars to race to harvest sponsor rewards and Manager XP, so log on, click on practice lap, then immediately log off without setting up the cars or setting a decent strategy/push level for AI to work with? They will continue to be a menace to those that have set up.

Late in the season, when the championship has already been decided, in many leagues a higher proportion of lower placed teams will save engines. Even if they do a practice lap and set up they'll still be very slow.

What about two car leagues? Is the logic going to check practice laps for both cars in a team and if necessary only exclude one of the two cars? I don't imagine this would be as simple as excluding a team of one.

How about manager rep? Is this calculation going to be based on the number of cars in the league/tier or the number of cars that actually race on any given day?

What do we do with bot accounts that some leagues place in the lower two tiers to trigger promotion/relegation. Some leagues the lower tiers only have one or two active managers. Would the race still run if only one car sets a practice lap?

We've already seen QRs ruined by people who exploit them to gain driver XP. I fear there will be exploits we haven't even considered that would undermine an apparently simple solution.

I don't disagree with the concept, I too dislike cars that are not set up and encourage managers in the league I host to at least do this. I am just playing devil's advocate and suggesting that what at first appears to be a "simple solution" is often anything but.




Yea, I understand on some of those points. But unfortunately in a lot of leagues. The appearance of a "full league" can be more important than the notion of # of active managers. And at the end of the day, people have lives and crap happens and you get busy. It's perfectly understandable to miss a setup or two....but those cars should just get DQ'd from racing.


-If you DNF due to fuel or tyre rule or...I believe you still get XP and sponsor money...but you probably miss your sponsor goal. This should be treated the same I think. So there wouldn't be an incentive to login for a practice lap without setup. d

-I'm ok with the naturally slow cars that at least setup. I don't have anything against backmarkers in general cause I think it can be a strategic element of variability to the game. But it's just the non-setup ones. There's also plenty of managers who join late in the season and have a slow car...but as long as they setup and are active, i'm cool with it.

-Honestly I've never raced in a two car league, so I have no idea how I'd treat it there.

-Manager rep...just treated as it would for a DSQ for tyre rule or Suspension for Engine/parts.

-Yea the simulator starts if there's only one car with a practice lap. If no cars setup...then it starts and ends immediately after all cars DQ'd. But not sure how that works on the programming end.

-Yea there could be exploits...im' not sure. But if treated like a tyre rule DSQ, or suspension due to engine failure...im not sure what exploits there could be.

But yea, it's all good for discussion.
md-quotelink
angle-double-left ios-arrow-back 1 ios-arrow-forward angle-double-right

You must be logged in to post a reply.