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medal 5000
3 years 355 days ago
randoms are silly, yes they could stop the same managers from winning all the time but they could also make you worse.

you could get a random every race, it would be bad luck but it could happen.

less random, more player inputs.

give us more set up options, more things to build to make the team function better, i.e pit crew speeds and so on.
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medal 5000
3 years 355 days ago

Gaetano
Another pointless discussion about the usefulness of accidents in the game just to get closer to reality ... ridiculous
What kind of managers request incidents? Do we want to talk about realism? In reality no team manager would like incidents, maybe only Williams in this period, for obvious reasons ...
Tell me about the usefulness of these accidents, what are the points in favor that this update would bring, excluding the "wow as in real life" ...?
Mr. Dave talks about fan feelings, but we are not fans here. Incidents will not give us adrenaline, it would be GAME OVER, what gives us adrenaline is to quickly change strategy in the race to gain, use the boost to detach the opponents, and other things that concern the live of the race, not the incidents that would be the death of the competition.
I have the clear impression that you still have a lot to learn and the only thing you do is set the strategy and use the boost to not lose the drs ... in competitive leagues in 5-6 managers compete for victory, that is adrenaline, not incidents.
I have only one thing to say to everyone who wants incidents ... LEARN TO PLAY.



If you have no argument, patronise the one with the sound case. A poor tactic.

Of course no real F1 manager wants their cars involved in an incident, that you bring this up shows how desperate you are for. It's a ridiculous statement. 
Ok, I accept that you enjoy, and get a rush out of your abstraction of a race, yes, it contains strategy, but so does chess, of baseball or tiddlywinks. The issue is that the strategies are nothing to do with the strategies actually required to win a race. The drs train is not something that factors into any strategic thinking in real teams, and boost, at least in most formulae cannot do anything like it can in iGP. The whole environment and therefore the strategies required only bear a cosmetic surface similarity to motor racing. For me, in a motor racing management simulation game that is not good enough. iGP can be better than a strategic puzzle in a motor racing setting, it can give players similar strategic choices to Wolff, Horner and the others. 
That's the pro argument and it actually makes it's case without denigrating its opponents, it doesn't need to, it actually has intrinsic merit. Your case against doesn't. 
md-quotelink
medal 5222
3 years 355 days ago (Last edited by ʟ ᠎ 3 years 355 days ago)
Dave

Gaetano
Another pointless discussion about the usefulness of accidents in the game just to get closer to reality ... ridiculous
What kind of managers request incidents? Do we want to talk about realism? In reality no team manager would like incidents, maybe only Williams in this period, for obvious reasons ...
Tell me about the usefulness of these accidents, what are the points in favor that this update would bring, excluding the "wow as in real life" ...?
Mr. Dave talks about fan feelings, but we are not fans here. Incidents will not give us adrenaline, it would be GAME OVER, what gives us adrenaline is to quickly change strategy in the race to gain, use the boost to detach the opponents, and other things that concern the live of the race, not the incidents that would be the death of the competition.
I have the clear impression that you still have a lot to learn and the only thing you do is set the strategy and use the boost to not lose the drs ... in competitive leagues in 5-6 managers compete for victory, that is adrenaline, not incidents.
I have only one thing to say to everyone who wants incidents ... LEARN TO PLAY.



If you have no argument, patronise the one with the sound case. A poor tactic.

Of course no real F1 manager wants their cars involved in an incident, that you bring this up shows how desperate you are for. It's a ridiculous statement. 
Ok, I accept that you enjoy, and get a rush out of your abstraction of a race, yes, it contains strategy, but so does chess, of baseball or tiddlywinks. The issue is that the strategies are nothing to do with the strategies actually required to win a race. The drs train is not something that factors into any strategic thinking in real teams, and boost, at least in most formulae cannot do anything like it can in iGP. The whole environment and therefore the strategies required only bear a cosmetic surface similarity to motor racing. For me, in a motor racing management simulation game that is not good enough. iGP can be better than a strategic puzzle in a motor racing setting, it can give players similar strategic choices to Wolff, Horner and the others. 
That's the pro argument and it actually makes it's case without denigrating its opponents, it doesn't need to, it actually has intrinsic merit. Your case against doesn't. 



You're talking like this to one of the best players in the whole game. Just saying.


You need to understand that this is not a driving simulation game. Flags and VSC are already something totally unneded in this game. And you want to add more random.
This is a 100% strategy game. You can't drive your car in this game. So you can't crash or spin or other things like that. This game has nothing to do with real F1 or similar categories. This game has not to be realistic cause it's NOT realistic at all, since day 1. In this game, you overheat tyres on the straights and cool them down in the corners. Just this thing alone makes the game totally unrealistic, cause in reality it works the complete opposite way.
As a strategy game, iGP Manager should be 100% based on strategy (and I'm talking about all the "playable" things, not just the "race strategy" you can set up before the race). Devs should add more settable options, if anything. And not more random.
If I have 1 playable hour per day in total, from setting up to live race, I want to fully play that hour of game. I don't want to be thrown out of a race just because it's funny for someone else. I want to PLAY every second of my race, from setup to the finish line at the end of the race. I don't want more random. Many other players don't want more random. We don't need more random. Again, we need more settable things, if anything.

I just finished a race in the league where I'm racing now, I totally dominated it and deserved the win, until I got stuck behind a lapped car under double yellow flag because of retirements in the last few laps. I lost all the gap I had gained during the race with my skills and I lost the race just because of that. The actual winner wasn't even happy, cause he knew it was undeserved. He admitted it by himself without me saying anything. And he knew it was undeserved cause he's a top player and knows how this game works, he knows what big managers have to do during the race to fight for wins. And he knew he shouldn't have won this race. But he did. Just because of random.

Would you be happy to win like that? If you would, it means you still have a lot to learn about the things to do in this game to beat the best managers. Otherwise I'm 100% sure you wouldn't think the way you actually do. 
md-quotelink
medal 5000
3 years 354 days ago

Dave

Gaetano
Another pointless discussion about the usefulness of accidents in the game just to get closer to reality ... ridiculous
What kind of managers request incidents? Do we want to talk about realism? In reality no team manager would like incidents, maybe only Williams in this period, for obvious reasons ...
Tell me about the usefulness of these accidents, what are the points in favor that this update would bring, excluding the "wow as in real life" ...?
Mr. Dave talks about fan feelings, but we are not fans here. Incidents will not give us adrenaline, it would be GAME OVER, what gives us adrenaline is to quickly change strategy in the race to gain, use the boost to detach the opponents, and other things that concern the live of the race, not the incidents that would be the death of the competition.
I have the clear impression that you still have a lot to learn and the only thing you do is set the strategy and use the boost to not lose the drs ... in competitive leagues in 5-6 managers compete for victory, that is adrenaline, not incidents.
I have only one thing to say to everyone who wants incidents ... LEARN TO PLAY.



If you have no argument, patronise the one with the sound case. A poor tactic.

Of course no real F1 manager wants their cars involved in an incident, that you bring this up shows how desperate you are for. It's a ridiculous statement. 
Ok, I accept that you enjoy, and get a rush out of your abstraction of a race, yes, it contains strategy, but so does chess, of baseball or tiddlywinks. The issue is that the strategies are nothing to do with the strategies actually required to win a race. The drs train is not something that factors into any strategic thinking in real teams, and boost, at least in most formulae cannot do anything like it can in iGP. The whole environment and therefore the strategies required only bear a cosmetic surface similarity to motor racing. For me, in a motor racing management simulation game that is not good enough. iGP can be better than a strategic puzzle in a motor racing setting, it can give players similar strategic choices to Wolff, Horner and the others. 
That's the pro argument and it actually makes it's case without denigrating its opponents, it doesn't need to, it actually has intrinsic merit. Your case against doesn't. 


after these your statements we can declare the topic closed. you see that you have not understood anything about this game I would advise you to go to ..... to play something else. this is a strategy game not in real f1 game and i don't think it will ever be ..... sorry for you

md-quotelink
medal 5000
3 years 354 days ago

Dave

If you have no argument, patronise the one with the sound case. A poor tactic.

Of course no real F1 manager wants their cars involved in an incident, that you bring this up shows how desperate you are for. It's a ridiculous statement. 
Ok, I accept that you enjoy, and get a rush out of your abstraction of a race, yes, it contains strategy, but so does chess, of baseball or tiddlywinks. The issue is that the strategies are nothing to do with the strategies actually required to win a race. The drs train is not something that factors into any strategic thinking in real teams, and boost, at least in most formulae cannot do anything like it can in iGP. The whole environment and therefore the strategies required only bear a cosmetic surface similarity to motor racing. For me, in a motor racing management simulation game that is not good enough. iGP can be better than a strategic puzzle in a motor racing setting, it can give players similar strategic choices to Wolff, Horner and the others. 
That's the pro argument and it actually makes it's case without denigrating its opponents, it doesn't need to, it actually has intrinsic merit. Your case against doesn't. 


mmm WHAT? are you who have no arguments and talk about reality, I take your example on reality, and you tell me it's wrong? WHAT? where is your coherence?
You are the one who speaks without any sense, continuing to talk about reality after you told me that in reality no one would want incidents ... WHAT?

I am confused ... we are talking about incidents, you say would improve the game strategically ... ok ... HOW?
I want to know what new strategies would be in case of an incident ... what would you do? what would it change? what are you talking about? what is your concept of incident? what Mr. Wolff and the others do in case of incidents that we can do in the game?

Please don't talk about puzzles, chess, baseball, curling, horse racing or whatever, we are in igp tell me how incidents would change the game stretegically...give me/us practical examples please.
md-quotelink
medal 5000
3 years 354 days ago

Gaetano

Dave

If you have no argument, patronise the one with the sound case. A poor tactic.

Of course no real F1 manager wants their cars involved in an incident, that you bring this up shows how desperate you are for. It's a ridiculous statement. 
Ok, I accept that you enjoy, and get a rush out of your abstraction of a race, yes, it contains strategy, but so does chess, of baseball or tiddlywinks. The issue is that the strategies are nothing to do with the strategies actually required to win a race. The drs train is not something that factors into any strategic thinking in real teams, and boost, at least in most formulae cannot do anything like it can in iGP. The whole environment and therefore the strategies required only bear a cosmetic surface similarity to motor racing. For me, in a motor racing management simulation game that is not good enough. iGP can be better than a strategic puzzle in a motor racing setting, it can give players similar strategic choices to Wolff, Horner and the others. 
That's the pro argument and it actually makes it's case without denigrating its opponents, it doesn't need to, it actually has intrinsic merit. Your case against doesn't. 


mmm WHAT? are you who have no arguments and talk about reality, I take your example on reality, and you tell me it's wrong? WHAT? where is your coherence?
You are the one who speaks without any sense, continuing to talk about reality after you told me that in reality no one would want incidents ... WHAT?

I am confused ... we are talking about incidents, you say would improve the game strategically ... ok ... HOW?
I want to know what new strategies would be in case of an incident ... what would you do? what would it change? what are you talking about? what is your concept of incident? what Mr. Wolff and the others do in case of incidents that we can do in the game?

Please don't talk about puzzles, chess, baseball, curling, horse racing or whatever, we are in igp tell me how incidents would change the game stretegically...give me/us practical examples please.



Easy, a car spins causing a safety car, you are slightly out of your planned pit window, you'd have to change strategy on the fly but if you don't and your rivals do, then you may lose out. You have one lap to make a decision that may put you in a position to win, or to lose, a race. A situation faced frequently in motor racing, never in iGP. Yes, the cause of the situation was completely out of your control, but how you take advantage of it isn't. A good team boss makes the call, right or wrong and wins or losses on his/her decision making, a poor boss dither and losses the opportunity to own the situation.

The complexity of the interactions in this sort of situation are in the nuances, your main rival pits, do you? Another rival team is clearly on a strategy that meant that this is their pit window 'they got lucky' how do you counter? Do you double  stack your stops? do you sacrifice your number 2 driver to an inferior strategy to cover in case your call was the wrong one. We are missing all that strategy and decision making from the game, and instead have decisions that have little relevance to real life but are key in this abstraction. Do you not understand the difference? In gaming terms we currently to be successful have to meta the program, I'd much prefer to have to make calls that more accurately reflect those faced by real team bosses. Wouldn't you? 
md-quotelink
medal 5000
3 years 354 days ago
Dave
Easy, a car spins causing a safety car, you are slightly out of your planned pit window, you'd have to change strategy on the fly but if you don't and your rivals do, then you may lose out. You have one lap to make a decision that may put you in a position to win, or to lose, a race. A situation faced frequently in motor racing, never in iGP. Yes, the cause of the situation was completely out of your control, but how you take advantage of it isn't. A good team boss makes the call, right or wrong and wins or losses on his/her decision making, a poor boss dither and losses the opportunity to own the situation.

The complexity of the interactions in this sort of situation are in the nuances, your main rival pits, do you? Another rival team is clearly on a strategy that meant that this is their pit window 'they got lucky' how do you counter? Do you double  stack your stops? do you sacrifice your number 2 driver to an inferior strategy to cover in case your call was the wrong one. We are missing all that strategy and decision making from the game, and instead have decisions that have little relevance to real life but are key in this abstraction. Do you not understand the difference? In gaming terms we currently to be successful have to meta the program, I'd much prefer to have to make calls that more accurately reflect those faced by real team bosses. Wouldn't you? 



Easy..."a car spins causing a safety car"...😂😂😂
But if you are that car? what would be the strategy? 😂😂😂
It doesn't matter, it's fun like that 😂😂😂
Thanks for your great explanation...I understood ... I really understood that you didn't understand anything about this game.
What you explain you can do it even now, when you see an opponent go to the pit before you or after, you can decide to change your strategy, without having to have an incident as a motivation...
I advise you to gain a lot of experience in the game instead of thinking about the introduction of incidents...bye my friend...
md-quotelink
medal 5000
3 years 354 days ago
At the end of the day, they've already said that Cooling & Reliability need to be included more, but they are not going to do it with the suggestion here. At least me know.
Look forward to seeing what they do come up with, because right now it takes up more space on my web page than it's worth.
Apart from that though. I think you have an amazing game here. Really well thought out. So I'll live with this bit lol

Thanks All.
md-quotelink
medal 5001 Super Mod
3 years 353 days ago
Thank you Dean for both starting the debate and, with your post above, drawing the arguments to a conclusion. As you say, José has given us the "official" response and has stated that the developers have no plans to introduce crashes, spins or random incidents.

With this in mind I will close this thread.
md-quotelink
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