KERS fully-charged from start?

Jack, Nice resuming of things.
First you did not want to give non managed teams and disadvantage, but what you did make out of this is a Q-Lottery and punish online Managers. Been stuck behind unmanaged cars.
Yeah,.. that was sure an improvement,.. Not at all.
 
With fuel I kind of can understand. But still does not make any sense. This made a Q-Lottery out of this game and we all know been in front and you will win. So what is changed ??? Only that it’s more random who will win. Is this fair ? I don’t think so. Also now everyone goes for a longer first stint as for q fuel does not matter and in the race it’s an advantage.
 
I still think and I am sure others too,.. that the old system was way better and more fair at least for the people who actually play and pay for this game.
Why punish people bought 2D ??
 
More tire choices is a good idea,.. not like F1, but having 4 or more different tires make up a different strategy. As for now pole setter wins as everyone has the same strategy.  So actually all is a lottery.

I think I prefered qualifying when I first joined iGP as well. But I also turn up for my races.

1. With the new "kers from the start" being employed, manager who will miss the first part of the race will also be punished, they will not be on 5/5 and everyone can just use a little bit of kers to get past, resulting you end up almost last and not much more kers then others.
2. Everyone active will choose 5/5 push, the inactives are better off push level 3/5. They won't hold up active managers doing this. For the people thinking it's racing, you can't get past at any way without some luck and there are cases you loose 3 seconds per sector. With inactive mangagers behind, they won't get dirty air because managers in front are on 5/5, with means they're faster because otherwise they wouln't qualify ahead.

And yes you drop like a stone in qualifying but you won't get held up, because people in front of you are running lighter. You could this way run the optimal strategy, or gamble to run light so you can get clean air. You could also go very heavy, start at the back and go on much longer. The only thing you won't have this way is the ability to hold people up who are lighter and quali'd behind you. The things you get from this is that people can go super short stints, that aren't uptimal but get them pole, or they go safe with optimal, without the advantage of clean air, or they go even heavier, trying to keep within drs range and get some good laps with clean air while others have pitted.  

Wont Auto-kers just do all the absent managers kers on Both cars straight off the start? normally auto kers kicks in on every ones drivers as soon as available, so u can be sure all the low push cars will also kers past you aswell on 1st lap = stutus quo compared to normal. unless u block auto-kers kicking in on 1st lap....

Something that might add another eliment to the whole game is to build Qually and this is basically how it works.


EG. Your race starts at 6pm, so qually will open up at 5.45 to 5.55pm.

Qually will always use soft tyres (Unless changed by the manager) or if you want to impliment them at a later date. Qually tyres that heat up a lot quicker than softs. (Wet qually tyres as well.)


For active managers.

Do not lock tyres or fuel amounts.. Leave this open for the ones who turn up to make their own. This give another eliment for how much fuel you wish to run on tracks that are just over the .0 mark.. So if a fully pushing lap is 4.1 or 4.2 per lap... Then you can either put 5 and push all the way or you can put 4Ltrs in and wait for half way around the track and push for the rest... If you run out of fuel during the lap. You start at the back of the grid. (You own fault for running out and trying to push the limits.)

Once you have set your team up and are ready to go, you watch the track for the perfect time to press a qually button (Car 1 Q, Car 2 Q.) that will put your car(s) on the track... No DRS or KERS to stop people from drafting and slingshots.



2nd part for non attendance or late turn up's.

Add a Qually stint within with the test run page that is located in the advanced setup that only activates if the manager doesn't turn up.. (Basic safety net.) Here you can only set up to 4/5 push level. (You only get to use the 5/5 push level if you are in the 2D.)

In the basic set up's before anything is loaded, This is set as 2/5 to make sure that they have zero advantage and to also get managers to bother turning up to start of races.


Once the time runs out on open Qually... The AFK teams are then activated in pit box order from 1st to 30th with a few seconds interval to stop trains building up... This is activated 5 mins before the race starts...Once the last car crosses the line.. Qually is complete and the grid is set up...


Another eliment is that once the active manager has completed their runs and can see times.. They can tweek their 1st stint if they wish and will take to the grid with what they have set...


This is a basic version of what I am on about.. I think I have got the point across.. idk.

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That's not really true though. It's the opposite if anything? Fuel load vs soft tyres would make for more room for strategy if anything. The difference between 10 laps and 11 laps softs is minimal because the soft tyres are at such a low % after 10 laps that the 11th lap isn't worth much time at all.

5 laps softs vs 6 laps softs vs 7 laps softs would actually make for really interesting races if they started sequentially based on weight. The 6 laps over the 5 laps would be really close because even though the 5 lap runners would tear away from the field, the in laps for the 6 laps soft runners would still be on good rubber where they have good pace. So they could actually make up some really decent ground. Same goes for 7 laps vs 6 laps... and 8 laps vs 7 laps.

I mean if we're talking about static gameplay, it can't really get much worse than it is? We really do have 2/3 strats at most that we use in the top competitive leagues, and almost always is everyone doing the same thing.

I guess another work around would be to keep qualifying the way it is, but introduce some more tyre compounds. Super softs and mediums for example would be awesome. People can argue real F1 doesn't let you use 4 dry compounds per race, but after all this is only based on F1.

Getting back on track (if you will pardon the pun)
KERS fully charged from start
And i'm sure making it a 5-sec burst per push wouldn't be too much of a coding change?

Simon we're talking about other solutions for the problem, witch is getting held up at the start of a race. These other solutions could make it that KERS from the start isn't needed, as some, including me, think it's not good for the racing.

Even if u decided not to have kers from the start can u at least make it charge quicker on some tracks, Monza for example u dont get kers till lap 7, the 1st stint is almost over by then for 2 stoppers in 50% races.
Not that i do 25% races but that would be over half the race finished b4 u can use kers.

That's a good suggestion Gary.

How about making it available from the start of lap 3 then?

Gary C-W has a good point.

And a little note to those who cant seem to overtake absent drivers without kersing. There is a function in the game that make your drivers better. It's called training. Try to train your drivers offensive competense. Maybe the one you are trying to overtake has a high blocking value? You don't know why it's difficult to overtake, don't just blame the game. Try to do a better job yourself.


I hope kers adjustement will be on hold for a while as the DRS change is quite a big change to how the game might play out. Don't change too many parameters at once. 

@ John,  hahahaha,.....  Train your drivers LOL  I see you when you have 300+ races and more knowlegde how it works,...

That's a good suggestion. If I may add another - reduce the amount of KERS available in a race. I'd be willing to see it cut in half, personally.

John makes a good point & having done more races does not make your point more valid.

I know there haven't been updates for some time, but we cannot release the next thing until the current change has been thoroughly tested by you the users.

I'll add my opinions to the pile.

Short Term: Don't mess with KERS right now. It is not clear that any improvement in the game will be worth the effort of changing and evaluating the change, particularly when large changes to the game loom just over the horizon.

Long Term: Please consider why you have KERS as a player-controlled feature. In real-life the race engineer is not turning KERS on and off from the pit wall. This should be a driver-controlled feature only. Suggestions for making it more realistic:
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[*]Make KERS one of the design elements (like the chassis) and/or a purchased component (like the engine). In theory it could be both. That is, after you purchase it, it still must be integrated into your design.
[*]Allow driver attributes to affect how well a particular driver uses KERS. Some drivers will be better at using KERS than others and it should be improvable through training.
[*]Perhaps allow player-controlled strategy to affect how the driver uses KERS. Examples: More early in the race or more later, more offensive or more defensive, etc.
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Thanks for your attention to players' concerns.

Dave

Maybe if people did less races, and longer ones, they'd appreciate the way the passing and training actually works for those who do. Perhaps things need adjusting only depending upon the % of the race distance being driven.

Well, it's quite clear that many people play the game differently to others. As with many of these threads; that which is popular for one style of play (daily 25% length races, say, versus a weekly 100% races) is not popular with the other, the changes being pushed through are a case in point.  It seems to me that it would be much nicer if there were more options for customisation within leagues as opposed to forcing all players down a defined path that is, ultimately, defined by the most vocal. 

Doing so will inevitably be more work, and take more time, and thus require more patience, but will be a better solution in the loong run IMO.  A quick fix here or there to please one subset of the player base may result in losing players in other areas. Still, I am sure Jack and co know this, so I don't even know why I am saying it.

For now, new DRS needs to be tested.

so being on 5/5 grey tires behind someone with brunt tires for a lap is my fault? don't say it's training because they've got full attacking. You obviously haven't played the game enough to see the problem

I quite like David Bradley's suggestions above.

Honestly, at the very least I wouldn't change anything until the DRS changes are fully tested. I ran Italy with another account recently and two drivers in the race were changing positions literally every lap. (This may not be a good example, because in Italy once you're past there's no real opportunity to get away unless you use some KERS, assuming car/tire condition is largely equal.)

If anything I'd like to see KERS charge more quickly, maybe about twice as quickly as it does now. Also, I don't think it makes much sense that no matter the league's race distance (25% or 100%), everyone gets the same amount of KERS. Personally, I'd like to see the amount unchanged for 100% race, but adjusted proportionally for shorter distances (racers running 50% distance get half as much KERS time as those running 100%).

Also, this may be a bit of a nitpick, but IMO any changes to KERS should coincide with a wipe-out of the existing race lap records (though the existing records should be saved for posterity).


Semi-related:

Seems to me the main problem is getting bottled up early behind slower cars. In some situations I imagine the updated DRS doesn't help with this, because in the first two laps, you can lose enough time to ruin your entire race. It would maybe be nice to know exactly what factors are taken into account in qualifying, which often can seem entirely random, and additionally how qualifying pace relates to/interacts with race pace. I've had races myself and seen others have races where a driver will qualify well ahead, and then be nowhere in the race for no discernible reason, but I've also seen a driver qualify well ahead and completely run away. I've also seen drivers be abysmal in qualifying, and then slice through the field and dominate.

At this point, I think to help with the issue of getting bottled up, I'd like to see it be possible to change your opening stint fuel load between qualifying and the race. If you set a strategy in pre-race expecting to be on pole and then you qualify fifth, it might be helpful to be able to add or remove fuel to change your pit strategy. Perhaps allow fuel changes but lock the opening tire choice, or allow free opening fuel and tire choice, but have changing your compound incur a grid penalty of some sort?

I actually like it the way it is,

A lot of those who would like kers changing seem to be higher level players, it may be that it's more of a problem when all drivers on a grid are trained to a similar level and I would guess are developing cars in a similar way?

Branching off from David's idea, How about an expensive magic black box which you can buy at say manager level 16 to plug in to your kers and gives you kers from start? Would be something to aim for after level 10.

If everyone has it from the start then I can't see that anyone really gains.

If you're on warm tyres stuck behind a slower car on the opening laps then maybe push levels need tweaking instead? You would assume absent drivers are not set to push hard.

With kers off the line it would penalise absent managers even more than they are already.

What about the managers who hit pro before they get kers? It's bad enough knowing you've no chance of winning without being left for dead on the start line. The current kers setup at least gives them a few laps to play with the others.

The fact that tracks differ in how long it is before you get kers charged is a good thing imo, it adds a bit of variety. If we wanted all tracks to be the same then we'd be running round in circles like those peculiar people the other side of the pond do.

I sort of like the idea of making other driver's kers hidden but wouldn't it encourage people to hoard their kers til the last lap even more than they do now?