Where are we these days?

The complication isn’t necessarily an issue. However, many who play don’t know how to train their drivers properly, develop their cars optimally or even fuel efficiently so adding complication would introduce new challenges to the games appeal.


Earlier in this thread there are suggestions for a pyramid structure or level banded leagues below Elite.  These imo are better suggestions(not saying some of your ideas can’t be incorporated) as it would allow the lower levels and less experienced managers to be more competitive until they able to unlock Elite divisions.  Of course the drawback would be similar to my objections to placing restrictions on lvl 30’s since some lower level would not be happy no longer being race with friends or leagues of their choice.

You're right that many new managers will have to learn the ropes, all of it.  But what better place to learn than in a challenging environment from the best?  Having said that, maybe both ideas can be combined.  I'm curious what the iGP staff thinks about these ideas, if they like it, and if they think it's feasible?  If they like it but takes time, we may need some quick gains first. Like making bigger XP gains per race, and increasing the research % gaps per level by a lot. Those are quick fixes I'm sure and will buy us some time, let's face it.

Many things could be copy-pasted from the current code.  Reputation is already there, I think it works fine, could need some fine tuning, who knows.  I'm not sure how it works now, but let’s imagine this:
 
we have 2 key elements defining your performance level:
1) XP: grows in a linear and predictable way, this is our current ‘team level’ system.
2) Reputation: flows based on results on track and the reputation of those you raced against.  So if you’re a young manager racing in a tough league including a peak level 30 team among others, you gain reputation quicker when doing a good job.  While naturally there will only be one, maybe two teams in the same league reaching a level 30 status. Because only one team in a league can win at the same time. In a Red Bull – Mercedes 2021 kind of scenario it may be 2 teams, who knows 3 but you get the picture, it’s maths. Last seasons champion might have a bad season and fallen back to level 29 or 28.
 
How might the Reputation score be put together?  I’m thinking of a system like the sponsors expectation: expectations for results to achieve will be based on your XP and not on your reputation.  That means that a newer team with lower XP will have an easier time achieving expectations and increasing Reputation, while an experienced team with huge XP will have big factories but also big expectations and if they don’t get the results their Reputation score will decrease.   Having an upper limit in XP points or not is up for debate.
 
And on a visual note: I imagine the HQ page showing pictograms of  buildings with cracks and weeds. Time for maintenance: 7 days or 150 tokens. Better get your act together and work your team back to the top!

Before I finish, here is a simplified calculation to show what the gap in potential performance level on track could be:
manager 1: XP level 29 x reputation 4000 = 116000 (potential performance on track)
manager 2: XP level 18 x reputation 6500 = 117000 (potential performance on track)
This younger manager could have a higher performance car on the track despite having smaller XP and HQ. And he completely earned it. No artificial gimmicks, ballast or sprinklers.

Hi Kevin! 


Can you explain, why the upcoming W2W update could alienate L30 2D players? 

Hopefully IGP is aware of the fact, that the majority of competitive IGP managers are still playing only in 2D for certain reasons... 

3D mode looks modern and fancy, no doubt, but if you want to win races in a league full of skilled veteran managers, you are completely lost when you are choosing 3D, because nearly all others will drive in 2D.

BR

Marcus

Marcus is right, Kevin.  And your fear is completely founded. This sounds extremely worrying indeed. 

I don't want to sound inappreciative but most hardcore players of this particular game don't care about visuals.  3D looks fancy and good for replays, casual playing or billboards, but it isn't usable for extracting extreme performances. And that's what this game is all about, has always been.  What made this game stand out is its simplicity and hard fought battles on the edge between fellow hardcore racers looking to exploit every inch and every gram.  That is the real thrill hardcore players all keep coming back for.  You know, the ones who keep this game from dying.

This game has been made better in many ways since 2018, there is no doubt about that and we're thankful for it: the RF/NRF options especially are great. The tyres are more balanced, the push levels are... simply lovely.  And it's okay to offer some gimmicks, engine manufacturing and frills for tokens, I get that. And I'm okay with a 3D option next to 2D, everyone happy.  But if iGP stops offering a 2D raceviewer, it's game over. Totally. I hope Jack reads this.

For what it is worth Kevin, after this bombshell. I understand your point about the hall of fame, that is a very good question: how does anyone compare.  You just can't compare between leagues, they're isolated islands. I'm not saying the reputation system can't be fine tuned. But the reputation rules are fair for everyone within the same league, right? That's all that matters because you don't need to beat anyone on the track who is not in your league.  Only problem is what happens to Reputation score when entering a new league. It should be reset to a league average maybe?

It would stop the league hopping some managers do to ride the 'first season glitch'.

Hi Jose,


The performance gains using 3D vs 2D is already evident. If it grows further when W2W is incorporated (which it will), then that's effectively the end of using 2D competitively.

This I believe is what the issue is.

If there is W2W won't it make the cars that are fighting slower because are not in good racing limes

Won't You be stuck behind a car sometimes or things like this,or will it be just visual and not affect You?
I ask this because If it affects the Time everyone would Have to move to 3d i'd say,to see exactly where the car is ,If is worth to use boost and things like this

lol I thought I was missing something on this as couldn’t work out how w2w and non w2w could work in the same race.  Assumed they would update both.  Thanks for making it clearer

I don't know, I don't like being critical just for the sake of it. But this whole W2W situation reminds me of a city pub that used to be really popular—people went there because they had fun and could joke around with others. And even if the beer was sometimes warm, the company and the bartenders were always great, and it was a nice place to hang out.
Then, the atmosphere started getting more and more tense. The price of beer went up, and it kept getting warmer. They changed the mugs, but the quality of the beer stayed the same. The bartenders and the regulars got grumpier. People started coming less and less. And the place began to empty out.
In an attempt to bring people back, the owners spent all their earnings—and went into debt—buying an oven to start making pizza. And that saddens me, because it shows they didn’t understand that people didn’t go there to eat. They went to have a beer and joke around with the other patrons.


Now, to be a bit more serious.
I'm making assumptions here—probably unfounded, maybe unrealistic, even presumptuous. But given the kind of work I do, I can afford to be a little arrogant and speak my mind.
For the full development of W2W, we can assume at least another month of work is needed. From a business perspective, considering Jack is the only one working on it, that translates to an economic impact on IGP's budget of at least €3,500. That’s a significant portion of the borrowed capital.
So the question is: is it really worth continuing?

Do you mean there's less lag in 3D?

No. A visibility thing that helps with laps 1-2.

Now my whole pro league in my server is dead :/

Hi Archie
Your post suggests you have found advantages racing in 3D, I wouldn't know because the couple of occasions I tried it I just couldn't get on with it.
Question... Do you still race in 2 car leagues? I ask because that is my preferred format (or at least it was until the costs went astronomical) and I don't understand how anyone could manage two cars in 3D.
Thanks.

Hi Kevin,


I no longer do 2 cars and I'm honestly not sure it's even possible to race competitively with the current 3D camera angles using 2 cars. Competitive 2 cars racing will only be possible with a top-down zoomed out view. Anything else is just a waste of time.

I use 3D only for laps 1-2 and I've seen a clear advantage, well it still requires knowledge but the advantage is definitely there to reduce bouncing.

I found an explanation and want to ask an extra questions:

Will talent work the same way? If yes, can team obtain a talent higher that their lvl? And if not, what will happen with a current drivers?
And, how will the training works?