[ROUNDTABLE] Tyre 'Cliffs' Update

I dislike this newer tyre condition.
Last race the winner made 5 tyres pit stops: is it real?
If we want to look like the real F1 management, this can’t be acceptable. If it’s all folks, you’re welcome.

Well, to be honest, racing in Turkey at the beginning of the season, considering this track's tyre consumption and short pitlane, I think the +1 pit stop was a good strategy.
Anyway I like the new update, it has made strategy less obvious and promoted a variety of valid strategies (50% length race) like never before

Edit: wrong account, I am Roones, not some rando ;)

In general I am glad the most recent ‘Tyre tweaks’ update has arrived, as it fixed the biggest issue of the tyre temperature plummeting once the tyre being used reached ~60%. However, saying that, I think a few things could be improved slightly.

1. The other main issue from the first tyre update (August) - How the tyre degradation affects lap times. Firstly, I like how the tyres feel and perform as new until ~75%, which I believe is consistent across both updates. Secondly, the drop off ~50% for all tyres pre latest update left SS useless, as Softs could hang on and then would become the faster tyre after only a few laps. Also, Hard tyres have become useless as well, as you can only seem to get 1 or 2 laps extra out of them compared to the Medium tyre, and the Medium tyre will remain the faster tyre for the large majority of the stint. The most recent update addressed the SS pace, which I believe hasn’t fully made SS as competitive yet, and didn’t address Hards.

2. I can’t fully explain this one, but although the first tyre update was quite unrealistic, it certainly provided a lot of excitement in race as there were lots of different strategies available that could compete with each other, especially in refuel. After this recent ‘tweak’ the strategy variation has certainly decreased, which can only have a negative impact on managers’ enjoyment of the game as a whole.

3. The balance between refuel and no refuel. Obviously as these 2 game modes are quite different, it was always going to be difficult to create tyres that work as intended in both game modes. In my opinion, refuelling really emphasised the strategy variation pre ‘tyre tweak’, whereas no refuel had less variation, but still enough to create intense racing. After the tyre weak, it reduced strategy variation in both game modes.

4. Weird instances of push level insanity. At certain tracks, there appears to be a bug where all tyres require a similar low push level to maintain temperature. I have only experienced this once, in Belgium, no refuel, where SS required pl1, M under pl2 and H pl2 (didn’t try S). I have heard some similar stories from people I race with, however I will leave them to be posted by whoever experienced them as I can’t recall them in enough detail.

Here is my suggestion to allow for all tyres to be competitive, and for strategies to have good variation:
- SS pace increased (more than the ‘tyre tweak’)
- M pace decreased slightly (must come at the same time as the rest of the points, otherwise S will be overpowered)
- H pace increased
- SS drop off occurs at 55%, and tyres immediately become significantly slower before becoming unusable at 45%
- S drop off at 50%, tyres decrease pace significantly as well, but less so than SS, and then become unusable at 40%
- M drop off at 45%, the pace decrease should be noticeable, but less so than S, and then become unusable at 35%
- H drop off at 40%, the pace decrease isn’t sudden, but gradually decreases until tyre becomes unusable at 20-25% (this seems a long way to take hards, but their pace is never amazing anyway and it is realistic for a harder compound to drop off more gradually)
- All tyres begin to gradually require a higher push level once they reach the ‘drop off’, but never more than a full push level between the drop off and unusable region. (Eg. M require pl3 at drop off and pl4 once they become unusable)
- Between the drop off and unusable region, all tyres have a linear pace decrease

My experience since the first tyre update:
- Discord World Championship (1 car, 100% distance, both refuel and no refuel)
- Project Leyendas - 6 races as a substitute (1 car, 75% distance, no refuel)
- iGP Championship 2022 (2 car, 75% distance, refuel)
- Various other one-off races as a substitute in both refuel and no refuel across 50, 75 and 100% distances
(Pre the first tyre update, I raced extensively at 50% distance in refuel and no refuel)

Let me know your thoughts, hopefully you agree with me, but if not let’s discuss.

Hi José, thanks for the reply.

- Obviously the ‘tyre tweak’ is relatively new so needs some time to be understood, so I’ll just see how it goes for a while.

- In my opinion, having the same drop off occur across all tyres and just fiddling around with the pace or wear of each tyre individually is a temporary fix for a tyre model that can be improved as a whole. Changing one thing always affects the balance of the game and complaints are made about other things.

- Just to clarify, all my points made in the suggestion required the other points to occur in conjunction for them all to make sense together.
- To explain the ‘linear pace decrease’ - for instance once a tyre reaches 50% the lap times should decreases by the same amount of time until around 35% where you currently have the tyre as unusable in a race. Eg. 50% tyre - 1.35.000, 45% tyre - 1.35.500, 40% tyre - 1.36.000, etc.

In my opinion , a good suggestion is taking off the coefficient of the tyre wear caused by the distance of the race. 
Racing at 25 and 50% now are really far from the real F1...
They should be similar to a quick race of saturday but they aren't.

may have a look into the Soft tyre, i think it is overperforming quite a bit. in 35°C condition way to fast and durable. people only use this tyre. Tyres like medium are way to slow to make an overcut advantage

I've concluded that there is no more viability to long stints. If you think you can do it in one less pit stop, you cannot. 

At the start of yesterday race, in the first lap, where temperatures are still not an issue...

S where slower than M since the moment the lights got out. That doesn't make sense to me tbf

That almost certainly down to differing PL’s, differing fuel loads and possibly temperature considering it was Abu Dhabi

Well, my PL was 5 in the first lap with S

It's a no refueling league so almost everyone had the same fuel (a lot)
And tyres where still not hot as at the start of the race everyone has tyres at the perfect temperature

So no, that doesn't matter

In no refueling races, M is the best tyre and everything else is useless. A lot of times Mediums are even faster than Softs right out of the gate. After a tweak Hards are now overheating at the start of the stint which makes them a lot slower and yes they last longer now, but only by 2 maybe 3 laps more than Mediums. I think you guys maybe are changing the wrong think here. Maybe it would be more logical to change the way different tracks affect the tyres, so it's not always the same compound for almost all circuits. I don't think it is even possible to make all compounds evenly competitive. One of the compounds will always be a better racing tyre no matter how much changes you will make, so why not change the way tracks affect them instead? 

Hi, sorry if you have posted this further back in the thread. What race distance are you competing at?


I’ve not tried no refuelling since the update but for me it’s the other way round in refuelling. S are much faster than M there. Trying to get my head around how it’s possible for M to be faster than S when both are fresh and fuel loads are the same.

Well dunno but that's what happened yesterday for me...

Checked out your race results. 100% What on earth happened in Abu Dhabi? Every team but 2 disqualified and most of them brand new.

Can see you going backwards at the start though, did you have old engines or overheat the tyres? Just looking for explanations.

Lol definitely bots.

Nop, not any wear at all in my car, nor overheated tyres (in lap one of course, later abu dabi at 33 c made it's work...)

Everyone got disqualified cause they are inactive, so I dunno what the base strategy was lol

75%. Mediums allow more push plus last longer.
Also, wasn't your last league race won by a manager who run primaraly mediums by more than 5 seconds? Well, there you go. Before the tweaks even Hards were better than Softs on 8-10 lap stints in some cases.

Having raced 75% no refuel, I can’t relate to what you are talking about. S tyres are faster for at least a few laps, but M can usually hang on. In fully populated leagues, eg. Project Leyendas, track position is very important so starting on S is usually better than starting on M. Btw the 75% no refuel experience I have outside PL is in a 2 car league with relatively wide field spread, which allows S to drop M before drs is active.

You really need to go away and learn the game before you start posting things you don’t understand.  Fuel load in no refuelling makes a massive difference if you don’t know how to calculate the correct load based on experience, track temp and likely push levels. 

However, you are racing  against inactive managers so a bit strange, but you didn’t lose any places on the first lap and it was lap 3 where you suffered most so still points at poor PL management.

Finally you will learn nothing in a league full of inactive managers  and most look like bots than real players (OMG I see  you are the host so they are bots) ?.  

Join a league with active players even if they are in a higher tier who you can ask for advice.  Unless you learn to train your drivers properly you will really struggle when you eventually race against live managers